No more Road for the Runner!

[Sixtynine_Bird]

I don't know if I'm ahead of you but I sure am on the good way lol
The work started at the paint shop. So hope it'll be home soon maybe in a couple of weeks who knows ^^

Saturday we went to the engine guy's house. He is like a Mopar engine guru! He knows hi stuff for sure. He has a really impressive garage with a lor of project on the way. He is finalizing a 512ci with aluminum 440 source heads hand ported with a main bearing stud girdle plate aluminum edelbroke intake hand ported to. This motor gonna be a killer for sure.

Anyway he sonic tested the cylinder wall of our 383 and he said that it is ok and we can bore it to 60 over. Now it is at 40 but the upper walls have a little ridge I guess this is how you call it.
So it needs to be machined.

He is also proposing us a 400ci moapr to replace our 383, what do you think about that? That 400ci has already been assembled and cam break in already done too, never installed and ran in a car though. The idea is maybe to reduce the costs.
We will see where we are heading with the prep of the 383 and compare it to the price of the 400 and take the decision from there.

But what do you think about running a 400 in a bird?

 

[RonLiv]

For me, I like originality, so if its a numbers 383 or Date correct one, or even just what came in the car regardless of the engine date, that is where I'd go. But if you're planning of driving it a lot and the 383 isn't reliable enough, then the 400 I guess.

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Thanks for your reply, i fact this is a 64 383 block, but the car was originally a 383 it is not matching or date coded but at least it came with a 383.
The idea here is to build something funny and reliable too. We want something that push in the low to mid 500 horses.

And as far as I am concerned I don't like that much the idea to put a 400 under the hood of the bird, but if there is a huge difference in term of pricing I might think about it twice...
Don't know what to do but I assume that money will know what to do lol so let's the money talk.

We are at the end of the project and still have an engine to build but money is running low right now.. We had so much body parts to changed that were unplanned that it dried us out. Hope we still can make something funny with that engine.

Anyway I'll keep you updated.

 

[69hemibeep]

Put a stroker kit into the 383

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Yes that is what our goal is.
Maybe stroke it to a 438ci with the 440 source kit.
Everything is in discussion right now between my dad and the guy.

 

[Russ69Runner]

That top ring can be cut out and should be. Would not bore it out to much. If bored out too thin it will want to run hotter. I don't under stand if the jug's are uniform from top to bottom Why bore it out another 20 thou. I would stick with what came into the car. 383. Maybe a different set of head's so it can breath better. With a better intake. Don't go with too big of a cam it will run rough. If you are going to make a driver out of it so you can go through a parking lot with out it crow hopping. That is what I would do. Russ.

 

[RKNRLR]

there are no trophies for leading the race at halfway Russ - just stick the course and youll see the finish line soon enough.

 

[RKNRLR]

from what I understand, the 400's have a big bore, so they can easily (cheaply..?) be stroked out to 512 CI, which no doubt would make for some fun times.
But Im with the gang on this one, If you can, keep the the 383. wait a little longer, save a little more and put some quality parts on that engine, especially if youre gonna do a fair bit of driving in it.

Good luck, hope the car fulfils the potential you have dreamed of in your head!

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

To be honest I'd like to keep that 383 engine too. This is also a possibility you're right, wait and save more money so we can achieve what we wanted from the beginning.
Russ from what I understood the jug's are not uniform from top to bottom so that is why he told us and verify that the block can be bored out to the final quote. Yes we won't we want t to be a cruiser a well as a killer street machine lol

Beside that we are moving forward on the front end. Planned to be done with the paint by the end of the week. Tonight we will prepare the garage by masking the sensible stuff around, and start epoxy priming the front end parts tomorrow.
I'll keep you updated on the progress.

Once every parts painted we can start the assembly of the front end.

 

[Russ69Runner]

Did not know that the cylinders where out of line. Yes they will have to be bored. Can't have taper in them. You can get better performance by changing the differential gearing. Like get rid of the old granny gearing out of it. Think most guy's will agree that if you change one thing then it effects something else like RPM's on your motor. Weigh and decide to get a perfect ratio all the way around. Good luck and keep up the good work. You guy's have put a lot of work into that old runner and it is coming along good.

 

[69hemibeep]

I missed the 400 option in my recent post. Make sure the 400 is built the way you would want it and he is not just trying to clear his floor and if it saves money great. The 383 even stroked some will pull more RPM if you like that kind of noise LOL

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Russ you are absolutely right, but this is the first he asked us about the weight of the car what trans and what gearing we have so he can match all that up. That is why I'm in favor for the 400 engine because it is already built and does not match our specs specifically.

To back up the 4 speed we put a 3.73 Richmond or motive gear (can't remember) with a truetrac. It will cruise a bit high on the highway but do not plan on going there that much. Maybe around 3300Rpm at 70, but the roads I'll take will be more like 50mph roads so we'll see what it does.

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Yes Bob you're right, gotta be careful about that even if he doesn't seem to be that kind of guy.
I would love to make it rev I do like a revving Mopar engine Lol

 

[quikbird]

was that a magnum force k member you are using? if so let us know how it fits and works for you.

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Yes it is a magnum force, this is the transformer Kmember with a manual rack and pinion.
I'll let you know about it right after it is bolted to the car. ;)

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Here is the sonic test sheet of the engine block :

 

[Russ69Runner]

What numbers give you the thickness from inside wall to the water port's and oil port's. When building a 440 back in the day we had the machines boring the cylinder's. He called us and said that he was getting close. How much more did we want to go. We said keep going. Latter he called back and said he was getting close to the water port's. We said keep going. Latter in the day he called back and said he was seeing day light We said stop. We put the motor together and cranked it up and it would get hot pretty quick. We did this for several day's trying to brake it in. Run it till it started to peg out on the temp. So we asked some of the old guy's we knew and they said put more radiator or bigger. We did that. But still wanted to run hot. So we end up trailering it to where we where going to race it. Would crank the beast up pull it to the line run the race and shut it down at the end of the quarter. Then pull it back to the pit area. It was a beast on the track and back road's. but was not a driver for the road. Two bags of Ice on the intake before pulling it to the line. That motor broke every thing from the motor back. But being young we would fix the stuff it broke and raced it again. Those where fun time's.

 

[ACME A12]

I'm really not the guy to answer that question. My understanding is the 383 HP should have the crank from the 440 though.

Two different engine families, two different crankshafts. The 383 (B engine) crankshaft has a 3.38" inch stroke and the 440 (RB engine) has a 3.75" inch stroke. Main journal size is 2.625" for the B and 2.75" for the RB. Same size rod journals for both.

Sixtynine_Bird: If you're going for cubic inches use the 400 block. It has a larger bore than even the 440. EASY way to get cubic inches. I have a 400 block that I have been hanging onto for over 20 years just in case I ever decide to go for a large displacement B engine combo.

 

[RKNRLR]

Russ you are absolutely right, but this is the first he asked us about the weight of the car what trans and what gearing we have so he can match all that up. That is why I'm in favor for the 400 engine because it is already built and does not match our specs specifically.

To back up the 4 speed we put a 3.73 Richmond or motive gear (can't remember) with a truetrac. It will cruise a bit high on the highway but do not plan on going there that much. Maybe around 3300Rpm at 70, but the roads I'll take will be more like 50mph roads so we'll see what it does.

I just took my bird out on the highway (600km round trip) with my new 4:10 gears. 110km/h - 68mph - at about 3400rpm. But I do have the 275/60 R15 tires on the rear which help a bit.

 

[Sixtynine_Bird]

Hello guys,

I have some news regarding the engine. So the 400 block is stroked to a 451ci. It has a couple thousands miles on it. The engine will be disassembled and sonic tested to see if everything is good. The valve springs will be changed as well as the camshaft and lifters. Every gasket will be changed too. It has indy heads 440-1, indy intake and valley pan and a Milodon oil pan.
Buying this engine and refurbished it to as new condition will cost the same as if we go with our 383 and make it a stroker to 438ci from 440 source.

We are right now on a lot of thinking pros and cons. Staying with the 383 is more in the spirit on how we built the car, meaning that the car if you look at it without paying attention it'll look like a stock roadrunner with 15inch steelies, original interior and exterior, but if you start looking closer you'll find out that the car is everything but stock. No one is gonna notice that the engine has been stroked until we would race it from a stop light lol.

On the other hand, the 400ci has some parts like the heads and oil pan that we can not afford for the 383.

I would like to keep the 383 in the car, but the 400 is a good compromise too. I don't know lol can't make up my mind...

Also once the engine is done, we are not planning on modify it anymore, the car will stay as it is for a long long time.