Time to break down the engine

[Confederate1969]

I have the book "how to rebuild big block mopars" or however it was called. I've read it front to back several times. To be honest it makes this whole thing look a bit scary to me. Seems like a lot of things he talks about can end up being screwed up easily. Things like warping crankshafts and accidentally swapping push rods and stuff are not things I want to deal with. Is he doing this deliberately so newbs like me will be more careful or is this kind of task really this tedious? I've seen other fellahs do bottom end rebuilds and piston ring replacement before without much regard for these scary "Watch out for ____ or you're screwed!" lines.

I can follow directions pretty well. But I'm wondering if there are any quirks I should look out for or special actions I should take while I tear this block down. I'm talking about things like what to do with the pistons and crank while I have them out of the engine as I get it cleaned... Do I wrap this stuff up and put it inside a dry closet so it doesn't get too cold (and warp, crack etc) in my arctic garage?

Then, as far as the engine cleaning, my dad and uncles were always pretty redneck with this stuff. They'd just pressure wash an engine block then dry it and oil it before the rust starts. Is this "ok" or can this lead to problems down the road? I just don't have wads of cash to take this thing to a machine & clean shop. I'm having to do a poor man's restoration. I will do everything right, that is, no corner cutting. But I also have to do it on a pitifully small budget.

Any advice would be much appreciated. This is not Horsepower TV where I can just go "welp, we've reground the crank but just didn't like the journals so we've gone out and gotten a new performance crank for an easy 1500$." Screw that entirely. I have to reuse nearly everything and I want to take as much care during this process as I can.

 

[SomeCarGuy]

You might find a dead blow hammer to be of some use.

Not really anything to worry about. Worst thing is broken off studs. Especially for the water pump housing :brickwall:

There is really no reason you can't do this.

Most Mopars just need a new chain, gaskets, and degree in the cam and go. Seriously.

 

[Big John]

Well... I have the book but haven't read it cover to cover, so I can't comment on it.

Here's my method for pretty much taking almost anything (not just engines) apart.

First, everything should come apart without forcing it. Sounds simple, but it always amazes me stuff that gets broken by not having a little patience. Next, take the simple stuff off first. Third, document by notes and if possible, pictures. Fourth, try to put everything back in the same spot it was before. If there are several pieces that are identical, label or organize them so they go back in the same hole.

OK... that said.

The big block Mopar is pretty simple. First thing is take all the externals off. Valve covers, fuel pump, carb etc. Get everything out of the way. Next the intake manifold comes off. With each piece you take off, toss the bolts into a container marked "manifold bolts" etc. I use those disposable Glad containers for about everything now.

Unbolt the rocker arms and lift the shafts off the heads. Now I don't worry about keeping pushrods or rocker arms in their same position, but if you'd like, punch 16 holes in a box to keep them in order. With rocker arms.. notice there are there are left and rights. Pull out the lifters. If you are going to reuse the cam, it is very important you keep the lifters in order. I use a block of wood with 16 holes bored in it. Mark the front of the board.

You'll need a good puller for the harmonic dampener. I use an impact gun to get the bolt out. Cam bolt comes off and take the chain and cam gear off. Put the cam gear back on and use that to pull the cam out. Be carefull not to nick the cam bearings if you're not haiving them replaced.

Next the heads come off. The heads may stick to the block a little and have to be pryed off with a big screwdriver. Just be careful and be sure you don't drop one on the floor (or your foot) when they "pop" off.

Spin the engine over and remove the oil pan. Take a look and see if there is anything floating around in the base. Plastic pieces from the valve seals and timing gears are common.

Pistons come out one at a time. Keep the rod caps with each rod, another piece you don't want to mix up. Unbolt the rod and use the handle end of an old hammer to lightly knock the pistons out. Notice I didn't bother with a ridge reamer.

You'll need the right socket (8 point?) to get the rear seal off. Pull it straight up, wiggling it a little to get it out. Then give the crank a spin to see if all turns nice and free. Then take the main caps off (more pieces that need to go back in the same spot) and pull the crankshaft straight up and out.

There you have it.. a bare block.

I've cleaned blocks with solvent and a brush, but you may be time and money ahead to have a machine shop do it. I assume you'll be taking it there for some work anyway. Have them do new cam bearings, oil pump shaft bearing and freeze plugs. When you assemble, wash with powdered Tide detergent and water then dry with compressed air and wipe everything with something like WD-40 or CRC to keep from rusting.

Clean everything else the best way you can. Harbor Freight has a cheap parts washer that should work nicely.

Check and double check EVERYTHING you are going to reuse. Roll the push rods on something flat like a piece of glass to see if they are straight. Buy new ARP rod bolts.... I'm big on this.... I've seen way too many fresh engines come apart because they got cheap and reused the rod bolts.

I probably forgot something.. but that will give you another look at how its done. Don't be afraid to ask questions!

 

[Confederate1969]

John, I really appreciate that break down. One thing I am wondering about... since you have suggested having it taken to a machine shop. How much should something like this cost? And how do I go about finding a good machine shop? I don't know anyone that has anything to do with car restoration in Memphis.

A small question regarding the cylinder bores - does an engine rebuild demand boring out? Or can I leave my bores alone and thus reuse my pistons?

 

[Big John]

The bores have to be rehoned at least. As the engine wears, the cylinder gets bigger. If its worn too big, then it will have to be bored.

A good machine shop will measure the bores and pistons and tell if it needs to be bored or not. They can also check the crank for you and polish it. BTW, the block should be plate-honed. That is a thick plate is torqued to the block to simulate the head being torqued in place.

Finding a good shop?? Geez... that is a tough one. I just googled it and found a few. The best thing is to ask around.

 

[Basketcase]

the 440 I had in my other road runner was rebuilt by me and a friend back in '86. A friend of my Dad's had done several of these, so we did the work at his place. The machinist does the hard work. I had my block bored .30 over, typial for the milage. They put in new cam bearings,all new exhaust valves, hardened valve guides for unleaded gas,checked the connecting rods, and I believe the block decks were shaved for trueness. They hot tanked the block and heads. The machinist told me to drop off any other parts I'd like tanked, and they would do them all at the same time. Takes off all the crud and old paint. He let me make payments on the parts, as long as the machine work was covered. I was making minimum at a resturant, still living at home, so it didn't take me too long to pay the bill.
We took all the stuff back to Dad's buddy's place, and with him guiding us, we assembled my 440. I was surprised how easy it went togheter. And once you know what to look for, it's pretty hard to put things toghether wrong. Oe afternoon we had it together, and the next day we put it oin the car, oil primed it, and it fired right up. I had bought things like a new clutch,starter,water and fuel pumps, had the carb rebuilt, so that helped.
The cost for the machine work, and the parts was around $1700. worth every penny. I never had a lick of trouble with the engine.
I hope to have the engine gone over some time to see if the fire hurt it.

 

[Big John]

Here's a question... if money is tight... does the engine really need rebuilding? How many miles does it have on it?

Maybe a cylinder leakdown test might be the thing to do and go from there.

 

[Confederate1969]

The engine has not run since around 1981. There were parts missing from it the day I rolled it into my garage. No alternator, no starter, the clutch was disassembled, fuel and throttle lines were all disconnected, and a bunch of other stuff out of place. I have tried turning the crank, it won't budge at all. Who knows what that will lead to. The engine has 84k on it... I have no idea of the history whether it was ever rebuilt or not. It's in such a state that even if everything had been connected, I still wouldn't take a chance on trying to start it, much less driving it like I stole it. A rebuild is entirely necessary. Even when my dad was still around, it was always on the docket to rebuild it.

Aside from the necessity of a rebuild, there's the knowledge aspect to consider. I don't want to be one the dumb kid at local car shows that knows nothing more than how to hit the gas because his daddy was the one who bought and maintained the car. (We all know they exist) Instead, I want to know my engine inside and out. When I hear a ping or a pop or a bang, I want to know what it is, just the way my dad always did. Rebuilding all of this, as difficult of a learning curve as it is for me, is half of the reason I have it.

If my dad had kept the RR in tip top shape the past 3 decades, no I probably would not even think about all of this that I'm doing now. But he let it sit for a long time because he got busy making sure we had everything we needed rather than what he wanted on the side. So it has deteriorated and lost parts in its moves from place to place over the years.

But yea... to answer your question, it really does need rebuilding unfortunately.

 

[John69RR]

Confederate, BigJohn gave you a pretty good guideline to follow. As for machine shops, I'm sure there are cruising hot spots in Memphis. Get up with a few of the Mopar owners and ask for their opinion and experiences with local shops. Word of mouth is the best advertising. Since the engine is seized, there is really no telling what is wrong until you pull the heads and oil pan. Don't forget to drain the oil. That makes for a big mess. John I believe the rear seal needs a 3/8" 12 point socket.

 

[Big John]

Yep.. 12 Point socket.

I just remember its one of the special sockets in the top of my tool box.

 

[Plymouthfan]

Take lots of pics and keep us updated.....

LOL, this makes me want to tear my 440 apart!