Possible engine or transmission leak?

[Russ69Runner]

Have put in a few seals and it is a job no matter what. With rope packing use to use a the small Guitar wire to pull it through. Made a hole in one end with a needle then put the wire through the hole. Twisted the wire with needle nose pliers you need two pliers. Put the hole about an 1/8 inch from end. Oil it up and pull it through pushing on the other side. Sometimes use a small wood dowel sharped like a screw driver tip. But not sharp want it blunt to help in pushing the seal through. It should be the with of the seal material. Well that is what I was shown with the older motor's. Have had to loosen crank bearing bolts on some motors then retorque them to specks.

 

[Rick Rockett]

Have put in a few seals and it is a job no matter what. With rope packing use to use a the small Guitar wire to pull it through. Made a hole in one end with a needle then put the wire through the hole. Twisted the wire with needle nose pliers you need two pliers. Put the hole about an 1/8 inch from end. Oil it up and pull it through pushing on the other side. Sometimes use a small wood dowel sharped like a screw driver tip. But not sharp want it blunt to help in pushing the seal through. It should be the with of the seal material. Well that is what I was shown with the older motor's. Have had to loosen crank bearing bolts on some motors then retorque them to specks.

I bought a “Sneaky Pete” tool for removing & installing rope seal around the crankshaft (don’t know if I have a rope seal in there now or not). But I thought that the rope seal had to be pounded into the groove all the way around in order to work (there are YouTube videos of guys using a tool to pound/pack the rope into the groove... crankshaft removed, of course). Thus, I’m thinking about using the neoprene seal, since it slides up through the groove [easier?]. But there’s a lot out there that says that the neoprene seals don’t make good contact with the crank all the way around, because the seal retainer was never machined exactly with the crank centerline (the old rope seals would swell & close up the poor alignment area).
So, I’m pondering what to do here.

 

[Rich B]

Recall as even the neoprene new or used in other applications can shrink, become brittle. A few products out there to return them to that supple characteristic. Do they work? Sometimes.... The ones I was familiar with had an adjusting nut to retain packing so as not to leak water too much but not seize up the shaft (fire pumps). After awhile yes, they too had to have new packing as packing nuts can get maxed out over the years.

Can’t vouch for crankshafts but oil would be more containable than water I’d imagine? May be a suitable upgrade for that. But I can’t recall having any oil leaks with my 383 and even at 175K miles, car still looked and the motor sounded great.

 

[Bruce Cameron]

I took my 383 Road Runner into a restoration shop and the head mechanic is a MoPar guy. He went over the car front to back and, what I thought might be a rear main seal leak was the reverse light sending unit on the top of the 4-speed transmission. A lot cheaper to fix.

 

[Rich B]

Forgot all about those, that pod with the yellow lamp on middle of lower center dash; I may be off a bit on that too. Too never fill that tranny with 90wt gear oil- great in the summer but winter a bit sluggish to shift; in fact almost impossible on those 30 below mornings......

 

[Russ69Runner]

That is why you loosen the crank bearing gives you enough room to put the packing in using the wooden dowel to push it into the grove. Forget the pounding when you tighten up the crank bearing it will finish pushing it into the grove. When we raced that was something we had to do quite often on our 440 police intercept motor. It was from Plymouth Fury Hwy patrol car.

 

[Rick Rockett]

That is why you loosen the crank bearing gives you enough room to put the packing in using the wooden dowel to push it into the grove. Forget the pounding when you tighten up the crank bearing it will finish pushing it into the grove. When we raced that was something we had to do quite often on our 440 police intercept motor. It was from Plymouth Fury Hwy patrol car.

Russ, do you think the rope seal does a better job than the neoprene/rubber seals?
Did you only loosen the rear bearing cap, ...or ALL the caps?
Why would the rear seal be done so often during racing?

 

[Russ69Runner]

Well I think it is because of all the heat in that area plus the torque on the end of the crank. Yes loosen all the crank bearings gives you the play you need. Had problems with the rubber seals wanting to squeeze out sure it is a two part seal rite. The neoprene just cant take heat like the packing can. Found they got brittle and even pushed out. Too bad they could not put a seal in like the front seal for the rear. It is up to you Packing gland packing lasted longer.

 

[Denny]

I'd be interested in this also; pan, or rear seal? I'm changing out my oil pan this week, 7 quart aftermarket sprung from being hit. I'm hoping to just move the drag link and raise the motor up about 6".

 

[Russ69Runner]

How high dose the oil go up on the block. Might check your valve cover's to see if they are leaking near the fire wall. How did the pan get hit. Cant say for sure but what I am seeing if it is the oil pan look's like it is near the bell housing. Is their oil leaking out of the bell housing dust cover or just coming from the front or on just the front of it. Good indication it is the oil pan leaking.

 

[Rick Rockett]

There's a good STICKY thread ("The Official Rear Main Seal replacement thread") over on ForBbodiesOnly.com (Forums > Classic Mopar Tech > Engine, Trans & Driveline) for anyone who hasn't done this job before.
I had not a clue, & very little experience overall. But after a lot of reading there & elsewhere, I did a rear seal replacement on my 383 and I'm happy to report that everything is DRY under the car now! In hindsight, it's a pretty straight-forward job. Once the steering linkage is out of the way (use a good tie-rod fork & have new tie-rod boots on-hand because you'll likely destroy the old ones), the second worst part of the job is the oil pan & windage tray & the TWO sets of gaskets you'll need to juggle with it all. Check out the thread over there if you're a newbie like me. Take all the scary stories with a grain of salt ... I found none of the "horror" to be true & I wrote a long post there yesterday (9-10-19) about that.
Interestingly, I had initially thought that my newly replaced seal was leaking, because I've had a small oil drop on the bottom of my flywheel dust cover. Turns out, my pan gaskets were leaking because I used too much RTV on that "sandwich" (pan - gasket - windage tray - gasket - block) ...a corner of a gasket had oozed out a bit. My point: an oil pan leak can look more like a rear seal leak, since apparently it all swirls around at driving speed & ends up on the bottom of that flywheel cover ... right at the weep hole on the bottom ...& looking like it must have come from the rear seal. (So, yeah, I had to re-do the worst part of the job ...steering linkage disassemble & oil pan gaskets.) But all is now DRY underneath! A THIN smear of RTV on both sides of both gaskets is enough to help seal any imperfections in the surfaces. Too much peanut butter on that "sandwich" & your gaskets will ooze out!!

 

[Denny]

How high dose the oil go up on the block. Might check your valve cover's to see if they are leaking near the fire wall. How did the pan get hit. Cant say for sure but what I am seeing if it is the oil pan look's like it is near the bell housing. Is their oil leaking out of the bell housing dust cover or just coming from the front or on just the front of it. Good indication it is the oil pan leaking.

Russ, Oil on the block was from the valve covers. I've already corrected that; guess I didn't clean the block afterwards. It doesn't show on this photo but the front of the pan hit something. The front of the pan is distorted (bent). I'll be removing the bell house cover to check if it shows any oil in the area of the rear seal.

 

[Denny]

There's a good STICKY thread ("The Official Rear Main Seal replacement thread") over on ForBbodiesOnly.com (Forums > Classic Mopar Tech > Engine, Trans & Driveline) for anyone who hasn't done this job before.
I had not a clue, & very little experience overall. But after a lot of reading there & elsewhere, I did a rear seal replacement on my 383 and I'm happy to report that everything is DRY under the car now! In hindsight, it's a pretty straight-forward job. Once the steering linkage is out of the way (use a good tie-rod fork & have new tie-rod boots on-hand because you'll likely destroy the old ones), the second worst part of the job is the oil pan & windage tray & the TWO sets of gaskets you'll need to juggle with it all. Check out the thread over there if you're a newbie like me. Take all the scary stories with a grain of salt ... I found none of the "horror" to be true & I wrote a long post there yesterday (9-10-19) about that.
Interestingly, I had initially thought that my newly replaced seal was leaking, because I've had a small oil drop on the bottom of my flywheel dust cover. Turns out, my pan gaskets were leaking because I used too much RTV on that "sandwich" (pan - gasket - windage tray - gasket - block) ...a corner of a gasket had oozed out a bit. My point: an oil pan leak can look more like a rear seal leak, since apparently it all swirls around at driving speed & ends up on the bottom of that flywheel cover ... right at the weep hole on the bottom ...& looking like it must have come from the rear seal. (So, yeah, I had to re-do the worst part of the job ...steering linkage disassemble & oil pan gaskets.) But all is now DRY underneath! A THIN smear of RTV on both sides of both gaskets is enough to help seal any imperfections in the surfaces. Too much peanut butter on that "sandwich" & your gaskets will ooze out!!

THANKS ROCKET! Not sure if it has a windage tray or not. I should expect it as the car was set up for racing. Guess I'm not prepared for it, only have one new gasket. Back to parts store.

 

[Russ69Runner]

Denny if you take some sowing thread and tie the pan gasket to the oil pan then start to bolt the pan on loosely. Put all the bolt's in not tight then cut the string and pull it out will make putting the gasket on much easer to manage a gasket. This work's well with most gasket alinement problem's. Was taught to do this when in my teen's. Good luck.